[fpc-pascal] What to do to get new users

[Rainer Stratmann]

Am Mittwoch, 16. Oktober 2024, 11:07:25 CEST schrieb Nikolay Nikolov via fpc-
pascal:
> Or maybe, it's better? I don't know. Maybe explain what do you mean by
> "doesn't look like the project is very lively". Maybe we should post
> updates more often?

It all comes to the point of easy beginning.

For example if you look for Linux AMD64/Intel 64/x86_64 and want to download 
Freepascal.

You go to download. Then there are all kinds of various systems.

In my opinion it would be better to put the most popular systems on top.
This is Windows and Linux.

So you have to search AMD64/Intel 64/x86_64 and click on Linux.

Then if you click on SourceForge again you have a big confusing list of things 
you can download. At least for a beginner who wants to start coding. And that 
is the topic here: What to do to get new users?

If you click on Hungary/Canada this situation is not much better.

And if you finally got the right Package and were able to install it what do 
you have? Only the compiler.

This method is suitable for the experts of the experts. But not at all for a 
beginner.
 
> Kinda agree, at least for beginners and for small programs. How about
> the console IDE? I sometimes prefer it for small programs. But for large
> programs, nothing beats Lazarus.

Console IDE :-) Then better Lazarus.

> Free Pascal is exactly as "scattered" all over the Linux system, as gcc,
> clang, rust and pretty much any other compiler. How is this exactly a
> problem, since all major distros ship fpc as an official package and it
> is used to build other packages as well? It's not exactly difficult to
> do e.g. on Fedora:

In my view that is a huge problem. You defend it simply by saying other 
programs do it, too. You rely on the distro in relation to updates.

I am very experienced in making software that my clients understand. If I 
would throw the software in front of my clients like this I had no chance to 
sell it to them and to survive. I know exactly what I'm talking about. If 
there is an Update of the software more than 100 clients can press a button 
and in 10 seconds at the latest they have the newest version. I'm putting it 
on a golden platter because they don't even have to pay for it at the moment. 
Because I see it also as an advantage for me to learn from the clients needs. 
And it is a very big advantage to have a fast feedback. Instead of waiting 
years for the newest version.

With one ZIP File that contains all necessary files you can have a similar 
effect.

> Even strange distros like NixOS ship fpc. I'm sorry, but I don't get it,
> how is this a problem? Maybe for people who are new and want to get into
> FPC development and want to build it from source? But definitely not for
> new users.

May be it has changed (a little bit), but at least in the past it did not work 
smoothly  "out of the box". I am happy if I get Freepascal/Lazarus to work on 
my Debian distro. And then I cut the internet access and don't touch it 
anymore for years. Because I am afraid that something goes wrong and I have to 
start the whole process again.

It would definitely be better for understanding if everything is in one 
directory and not scattered over the whole system.

> 
> I tend to agree that Lazarus is a little bit too complex and convoluted
> for beginners.

:-)

> Still don't get it. Use your distro's package manager. If your distro
> doesn't package fpc, then become a packager and contribute fpc as a
> package. This way, fpc-compiled programs can also be added to the distro.